Theres no guarantees that putting a couple hotshot crews with good air support on that fire earlier could have prevented this tragedy, but that would have been more defensible. with a notice that evacuation is imminent would have been prudent. Wildland firefighters typically request Spot Weather Forecasts from the NWS for wildland fires or other events that can be greatly influenced by weather. Enter your email address to subscribe and receive notifications of new articles by email. However, to expect her to honor the NPS is inappropriate considering reality and her circumstances. I agree with the earlier post that if this fire had been in Southern California or other areas subject to devastating fire if it would have been managed differently. This is what happened with a handful of officials/personnel regarding the fatal 2000 black bear mauling of a woman hiker in Elkmont. It was so blatant and irresponsible of the media station to broadcast in this manner especially under the current circumstances. Kind of like closing the barn door after the cow gets out, dont you think? Local folks here who have been involved with Park issues have an old saying about the NPS and their mismanagement of historic structures. Standing dead hemlock burned up their trunks, to as high as 50 feet on one specimen I saw. There are a lot of downed trees and a lot of trails are temporarily closed to deal with them. Many, if not most, of these incidents leave the confines of the managing agency and sweep out onto lands owned or managed by others who had NO input into the original incident management strategy. Who allowed this to happen? Having said that, I used to work on an incident management team whose purpose was to manage what we called years ago, let burn fires. At 10AM we drove to Sevierville to buy more materials (to eventually add to the bonfire).
State charges dropped in Gatlinburg fires - Smoky Mountain News She has given me permission to share it on this site. Those with information are urged to contact the Tennessee Arson Hotline at 1-800-762-3017 or the GFD at 865-436-5112. You may have a point regarding lawsuits, reported actions and actual actions. If that was the case, then they had to be fully aware that the fire was going to come down the mountain and burn not only NPS structures, but Gatlinburg structures as well? I began picking up news stories of the fire in Gatlinburg from as the storm rolled east. It just so happens that at this time hundreds of fires were subsequently being started all around the south! I believe someone else may have mentioned this in other Wildfire Today article/comments? The main road out of Gatlinburg is the Spur, which is the 5 mile stretch of Park Service Road that lies between Pigeon Forge and Gatlinburg. We all contribute to this phenomenon if not intentionally but unintentionally, simply by the design of our brains! The person or people responsible for the fire have not yet been found. You do not hang your child or throw them out for, with good intention making the wrong choices, you teach them and help them to understand the consequences. The earlier fire on the hill was named Chimney Tops hence the name Chimney Tops 2 for the new blaze. What did City officials not understand about the approaching danger? ), lack of knowledge of alternative communication systems (the Motorola area wide emergency radio system installed last year). If I had even been in the bathroom or downstairs I wouldve died . Money and CNN. They were taught with classroom didactic and hands on training, by sharing of lessons learned by others, and the best learning opportunity available, the best teacher of all; the actual experience itself. For almost 24 hours a day for 10 days or more, I read everything I could about Gatlinburg, and even found Wildfire Today during that By the way, I havent seen any local media covering much for the victims since the coverage with Jerry and the pursuit of compensation. Not even 5 years ago over 60 homes burned in one night in Wears Valley when fire spread from house to house, in the fall, during a high wind. She may have chosen poor timing, and perhaps not the best method of tackling the issues, but nonetheless we need to start asking the tough questions without being so offended and then take a good hard look at the issues, and how they can be resolved. Ive learned so much on this blog over the past 6 weeks about how forest fires are managed and fought and Im most grateful for that. I knew high winds were predicted for Gatlinburg by watching the weather channel. I also noted that the use of Red Flag Alerts and prescribed burning around some of the more populace areas was both lacking, and being conducted during predicted high wind conditions. However, they are using a Super Tanker to douse the flames going on down there. It is good to question everything, all is not as it appears. We have a mountaintop cabin about 50 miles south of this area. Despite that, officials now say that the Gatlinburg fire began in the park and was. At 3:00PM I convinced my husband to call the Gatlinburg Fire Dept. A lot of personnel put forth heroic efforts to save lives and we should all be grateful for that. There were and continue to be many deaths and fires that occurred in those western areas, and with those IMT expert Teams, that taught hard lessons, and enabled those people to gain experience and become the so called experts in the field. Gatlinburg Fire 2016: The Start. And I dont write about that many of them. I can feel for the service providers and the devastated fire victims. Many on that team are not NPS employees, but are highly experienced wildfire fighters. GATLINBURG, Tenn. (WVLT) - Four downtown Gatlinburg businesses are picking up the pieces after a fire Sunday morning destroyed their building. Our Gatlinburg Inn was built on family and community. Given the wind forecast, pre-evac notice should have gone out on Sunday, Monday morning at latest. So whether the defendants started the 14th fire or not, a close examination of this Facebook press release indicates the fire apparently started on the 13th; and yet a social media photo post claims the 12th clearly showing a lack of response once again in fire suppression by the NPS. How did all the downtown businesses know to close and send their employees home, but not one word of warning was given to homeowners/residents? Though the drought and winds were undoubtedly an act of God (Psalms 148:8; 1st Kings 17:1), NPS and other officials were not left ignorant. That said I have been an avid backpack or in hiker who has done probably every trail in the Smokies many times over. That afternoon a Chinook Type 1 helicopter (Type 1s are the largest helicopters used on wildfires) began dropping water on the fire, refilling at Fontana Lake 13 miles to the southwest, according to a source we talked to who didnt want their name disclosed because they were not authorized to speak on the subject. The cause of the fire remains under investigation by the GFD, Gatlinburg Police Department, and the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation. I agree that there needs to to be a change of attitude about climate change, wildfire potential in the east, an adaptation to changing conditions and a throwing out of the holding on to the been there done that, know all there is to know, seen this before thinking and the holding onto a world that used to be. It works like an Amber Alert to people who download the app and sign up. Even this article seems to skirt around some of the issues and miss the depth of analysis it needs to effect meaningful change. Visited Gatlinburg for the first time in Oct 2016. It was gorgeous -huge, huge trees, open forest floor, very dark, very cool, very moist. Oh thats right they did but it was after everything burned! Period. Birmingham City have had to close their training ground after a fire caused damage on Friday morning. Even the courts of law no longer put as heavy weight on personal testimony, as so much has been proven to so easily be manipulated and affected by a host of factors. No warnings of spreading fire, just radar and high wind warnings. The fire gutted the entire city block and closed a dozen businesses. If their destination is not lit, they have to land there no later than 30 minutes after sunset. No. That should have been done over Thanksgiving! Fire managers brought in resources from all over the country. Officials said three people. They were asleep at the wheel. I doubt that anyone other than the arsonists intended to cause harm in any way here, and knowing the ages of those who lit the fire, I doubt that they themselves had any idea of the potential outcome. Sweeney, to be honest weve never experienced circumstances quite like this. I thanked her, hung up and told Stanton to go load Ladys kennel. One person was found dead Sunday. Thank you for your kind words and concern about our loss. Common since would tell you a mountain fire in wind and drought would move very fast!!! The fire resulted in the deaths of 14 people and more than $500 million in damage, with firefighting costs of more than $7 million. A lady answered phone. Until you sit in my seat after 20 years of fire service, making decisions on where to send your firefighters based on their experience levels, you will then realize decisions have trade offs and sometimes Mother Nature over rules you. By definition, prescribed burning is described as fire applied in a knowledgeable manner to forest and grassland fuels on a specific land area under selected weather conditions to accomplish predetermined, well-defined management objectives, pg 2, http://www.southernfireexchange.org/etc/ITPFISE.pdf. I may be alone in thinking that, but I do think the Feds would stand up to local influence. I get free speech, but if I yelled fire in a crowded theater when there was none and it contributed to death and injury I too would be held liable; my speech would not be protected! The age of information is both eye opening and scary, the potential for manipulation is astounding! Bob had stayed in West TN after Thanksgiving, to work there for a few days before returning home so he wasnt with us. Updated: Dec. 25, 2022 at 6:15 PM PST. But until the review of the fire is complete and the report is published, I would be careful with a statement like this: The Chimney Tops fire was a wildfire being monitored given limited resources initially because of the many other ongoing fires in the region to which fire-fighting resources were committed. I fully understand the financial difficulties of the NPS and with firefighters abroad. On Friday, Gatlinburg city officials released a report detailing the downtown fire on Oct. 9. By the time the troops were called in, it was too late. I can only hope that the actions are being undertaken somewhere and by the decision-makers and leaders to think and act differently. There were ashes raining and that was very alarming to me. The American publics outcry owe that much to the those whom lost loved ones, disrupted lives, destroyed both human property and natural resources in Gatlinburg, Tennessee during the Chimney Top 2 wildfire, November, 2016. This is a failure at the city, county and state levels, as well as top FEMA, leadership. The Gatlinburg fire that killed 14 people was started by two teenagers dropping lit matches onto the ground along Chimney Tops Trail in Great Smoky Mountain National Park, sources close to the investigation told the Knoxville News Sentinel. On Sunday when GSMNP called in helicopter water drops, there were 3 fire tanker planes sitting on the runway 20 minutes away in Chattanooga (covered in Wildfire Today). I have an Gatlinburg address but the county services my street. Ive not had a chance to hike post-fire areas in the mountains yet to see fires effect on dead hemlocks, but what Henry said about dead stumps burning into the ground looking like a volcano rings true with what Ive witnessed in mountain forest areas that burned decades ago. Being asleep at the wheel is no excuse. I was on the Party Rock fire in NC and our IMET was predicting that storm event 3-4 days before it happened. So property owners are left to deal with everything and if we had the power we would have done something like worrying the crap out of all of them until action was taken. Many locals are saying the lack of evac was income driven. Unfortunately its the home owners that are taking the hit and I think it should be them. Until 1 p.m. sustained speeds were 4 to 6 mph with gusts at 12 to 19 mph. Defense attorney Gregory P. Isaacs said the state can't prove that the horseplay of the boys, ages 17 and 15, sparked a fire in the Great Smoky Mountains National Park that caused the deadly . Here is a question & answer from Bill interviewing Tom Nichols on Wildfire Today: One of the more common errors in judgment you have seen on fires? U.S. Park Service (again) and Thanksgiving. As we reached the Parkway, everything was deserted. There should be accountability for those in charge, in every arena of governance and responsibility and at every level. Thanks again for this forum. But if park management had been spending budget on fire management capabilities equal to those sites there would likely be criticism of that. He actually wrote me back on Christmas Eve, of all things, to tell me that they will keep after it.
How many have died in the gatlinburg forest fire? - JacAnswers However, I still wonder why there has been no word from the governor about the post-fire review team he promised. First rule of any structure fire or wildfire. But outright blame? But the last one, issued at 7 a.m. EST on Sunday by Eric Holweg, did predict strong winds. I got out of the car and walked up to the side of the pickup truck. Shame on you. Most excellently put, Jeannine (you are an exceptional writer). Take a look at the Chimney Tops Fire of Nov 14th, 2016 and you really might begin to question what really went wrong here. We spent Thanksgiving there with our family, who left on Sunday. What about helicopters dumping water? According to a news release dated Nov. 25 from the Great Smoky Mountains National Park Public Affairs Office, the fires started on Chimney Tops Trail a few miles south of Gatlinburg, off U.S. 441 . The diff. It is very hard and slow to navigate through laurel stands and the thick Tennesee Barbed Wire Briar patches. Almost every creek drainage in GSMNP has stands of dead hemlocks (though some areas near roads had some hemlocks treated regularly to prevent adelgid infestation). People need their jobs, and we all act based on the limited information, training and experience that we have and hopefully rely on others who have diverse backgrounds to supplement where we may lack. The electricity goes out almost everytime there is a high wind. I learned that it is extremely difficult to manage, rather than suppress, a wildland fire for an extended period of time. I would suggest that you read over Bills articles on this site regarding NPS releases information about the Chimney Tops Fire 2 and Analysis of wind, vegetation, and air tankers before the fire burned into Gatlinburg. Will Lessons Learned fade into distant short-term US fire management history archives once again. My family lives 15 mi. A couple of weeks after hearing no hardcore news from Knox News, I wrote the editor asking if the News was still doing hardcore investigation of the fire. Hit it with all you have the Moment it breaks out.. Many are willing to allow the absolute open permission to some to behave as they will without question, but are unwilling to allow others the same room to learn and grow. This is just one more example of one more related issue that is seemingly un-connected until you delve into the issues deeply. It certainly should be addressed, by We, the People. Where was all the HELP TO PUT THIS FIRE OUT A WHEN IT STARTED???? This Park Ranger was appointed to this position in December 2014 and he took office in February 2015, so in a span of one year and nine months he managed to let the place burn and we have owned property there for 32 years and nothing remotely like this has ever happened. Bob, I know where youre coming from. An ongoing lawsuit against the National Park Service over its handling of the 2016 Gatlinburg Wildfire is on hold as a federal judge considers a motion to dismiss the suit. In turn, the IMT teams greatly appreciated the community support given by the effected areas, such as throwing a free Thanksgiving dinner for the thousands of fire fighters far away from their families. Not the best plan but the safest. If the superintendent of the Park Service couldnt see what the consequence could be then he was not qualified for the job and after reading his BIO he was never qualified and this is what we get. The Spur or US 441 runs between Pigeon Forge and Gatlinburg in the Smokies. Where the fire burned the valley floor, the desiccated hemlock burned freely and fully. Being that were neighbors with these people, its people that we love. It is unfortunate that in our society people who speak out with a loud voice, or otherwise make waves for the privileged, get not only scorned but categorically destroyed by well planned out and financed design, often full of cover-up and lies and then propaganda is feed to the rest of us, of which we often take for gospel, when in fact is often not based on evidence or fact. But when it's close to home, the sadness and concern of those affected is ten-fold in the worry department. The NPS investigation team has all this information and everything posted on Wildfire Today and a lot of info that was never made public. At 2 a.m. Monday the wind speeds recorded at Indian Grave began increasing and the direction became more consistently out of the south and southwest. A lot of chainsawing has been going on. I agree with you Bill that it isnt Most but whether it is a few or many isnt the point for me. It was hard to drive because of falling leaves, branches, smoke, wind, and nerves. Lastly, I would after this last election year never ever put stake into social media as any sort of official news, witness accounts or other fact finding mission. Fire behavior is predictable, based on things such as mentioned in this article; weather, terrain and fuels. This should not be a time to blame and inflame, but to think and act wisely. I said at the time thatvwas crazy, evac. Sometimes we win and sometimes we lose. Jim Renfro, the air quality specialist for GRSM, said the strongest wind gust recorded at Cove Mountain was 87 mph at 9 p.m. on Monday. Will some folks be held accountable for actions or non-actions related to this wildfire incident? A high-elevation area that possessed the largest unbroken Spruce-Fir forest in the S. Appalachians. As one who has had experience and ready mix, concrete block, pavers, and pre-cast, one would be a fool to rebuild on ANY existing foundation that came in contact with temperatures approaching 3,000F. Needless to say one tanker run can drop more water than two helicopters can do in a full day. Thanksfully ATF agents helped TN Bureau of Investigation put their full resources at hand and arrested to two teenage idiots that started the fire. How about that for arm chair quarter backing. They probably feel they are fortunate and safe because they will not speak out on the topic until the criminal charges are completed against the two youth that perpetrated this fire but they would be foolish to do so as time just continues to churn the anger.
Death toll from Tenn. wildfires rises to 14 - CBS News GRSM posted Fire Information signs in the area explaining their monitoring strategy due to vertical cliffs, narrow rock ridges and steep drainages. Who caused the fire in Gatlinburg? notice should have been at 5-6 given the wind. The Knox News timeline alone has enough info for several indictments. The two juveniles who set a fire are not alone in this. If one is growing by experience you keep them moving forward as we all benefit from their learning and experience. The extremely dry conditions in the area, though, should have raised the concern level. I called Bob, boys and I got a bite to eat for supper so we wouldnt be a bother to our friends whose house we were going to wait out the evening. There are many many folks who even if cell service were functional could not afford it.
Chimney 2 Fire Archives - Wildfire Today I knew him when he was at Indiana Dunes National Lake Shore. It is a truism that many people want all the benefits of government, but dont want to pay for them. We couldnt go up Motor Nature Trail so we went back to Cherokee Orchard Road. But any land manager that expects to allow active spreading fire behavior for weeks or months is knowingly taking a risk that a wind event unpredictable weeks or months in advance will occur and change everything, sometimes with a very undesirable outcome. The news person is very frustrated as she nor their rival Channel 8 can do no interviews due to the gag order. Often times in seeking to take out a person, the real root causes go unaddressed, and sometimes that includes some people taking the fall for decisions of others that were major contributing factors. NPS can suppress the first fire; but not the second fire?
Chimney Tops 2 Fire - National Park Service night at 9pm when mom said there was evacuation notice on TV.
This is how the devastating Gatlinburg wildfire erupted overnight Under ideal conditions they can temporarily slow the spread, which may be effective if firefighters on the ground can move in quickly totake advantage of the short termchange in fire behavior by constructing firelines, stopping the spread at that location. Regarding the Chimney Tops Fire of Nov 14th, 2016, https://www.facebook.com/GreatSmokyMountainsNPS/posts/1236286613095333. Deputy Park Superintendent Jordan Clayton said the initial fire on an area called Chimney Tops, a double peaked ridge line about 4 miles away from Gatlinburg, was caused by a person or. He had been experiencing the high winds back West all day and was alarmed at possibilities as well. When we got to the bottom of the mountain, we ran into the Sevier County Electric crew where the road was blocked. Then the wind comes!!! It would be interesting to dig a little further on this. The winds were blowing from the Chimneys more down the mountain than up toward LeConte. But the NPS didnt even follow their own rules in this case. So we can learn by others successes and failures but we must also not hang our hats on them either, because the story is as individual and unique as there are an infinite number of variables. I would like to insert the word, accountability into this discussion. We had no significant rain in 2 months!!! Nicely put together article. GATLINBURG, Tenn. (WVLT) - On Friday, Gatlinburg city officials released a report detailing the downtown fire on Oct. 9 that killed one person and injured another. The lawsuits from an event like Gatlinburg could go on for decades. Which is why human history keeps repeating itself over and over. It was considered a total loss after yesterdays fire. There are other potential hazards that make unplanned evacuations a danger in that area. This is as far as this subject needs to go; for the objective of this site is in regard to wildfire. Jody, you have said well what Ive wanted to say from my impressions made after the fire about this tragic situation. Apparently, when the second fire was started by the defendants on the 23rd, the NPS assumed they could handle the 23rd fire like they did the first fire of the 14th. I guess they must think when you have to go up there to handle this mess they caused that you dont need lodging, food or gas to get there. That didnt happen here. This isnt finger pointing its the simple facts of the entire situation like it or not! Typos, let us know HERE, and specify which article. The Tip Line is 888-653-0009. LeConte. This truck was also filled with firefighters. Hemlocks were mentioned in a number of daily updates on Inciweb because they are basically standing roman candles thanks to the spiral of limbs. I dont understand, but I dont judge. Civilians are dead, millions of dollars of personal property destroyed, millions of dollars were spent on containing the wildfirethe rains/snow finally suppressed it. I am not convinced that all of what is considered to be the Chimney Tops 2 fire is.
How the Historic Gatlinburg Fires Happened; a Humble Start - GovTech They should not be excused because they did not escape the consequences this time of their lax policies and their actual failure to follow the procedures they should have followed. Very well said Tommy. Experience must be coupled with training and planning based on forecasted possibilities and even un-forecasted what ifs. Over 130 sustained injuries, and 1,684 structures have been damaged or destroyed. Will there be an independent, non-federal agency, through,unbiased, unedited final incident management and serious accident investigation? On Monday November 28 it recorded wind gusts in that part of the state at46 to 60 mph, and a 76 mph gust on Wednesday. The wind and the low visibility caused by the smoke made it impossible to fly aircraft over the fire. The official cause is down power lines due to high winds and fallen trees, according to a National Park Service news release. We need to question everything and everyone with the same tenacious veracity as the other, but we also need to allow for humans to be human, and engage in the process of learning. Just a reminder to all, wildfires knows no boundaries, political beliefs, policy or management decisions just simple laws of physics and science from S-190: Basic Fire Behavior fuels, weather, topography and an ignition source plus extreme, well documented, long term drought conditions equals a recipe for conflagration, death and destruction. The fire continued to spread throughout the entire structure. All my constructive criticisms are not targeted to Park personnel in general. http://www.knoxnews.com/story/news/local/tennessee/2016/12/13/timeline-gatlinburg-wildfires/95138656/. The report stated the roof started to collapse, and the building was deemed too unsafe to work inside.
Massive Wildfire Engulfs Tennessee Resort Towns, Kills 3 Are they learning how to use it? National Park Service says never push a slower friend down when escaping a bear, Knoxville utilities crews work to restore power after intense storms, Missing elderly Knoxville woman last seen at hospital, police say, Vols drop to 5-seed in SEC Tournament after falling at Auburn, 79-70. the downtown fire on Oct. 9 that killed one person and injured another. It would be interesting to understanding the impact of excessive fuel from dead hemlocks, killed by hemlock wooly adelgid (together with the lack of moisture typically found under a mature, live, shady hemlock canopy, even with the extreme drought conditions) had on this fire. Anyone can arm chair quarterback incident manager decisions after the smoke clears. I felt it urgent to get out of the woods. Fire those managers! "We've had five (fatalities) really close together and this is more than we normally have by this time of year," Boyd said. When boys and I got back home around 3:45, the winds were beginning to pick up and branches were beginning to fall. GATLINBURG, Tenn. (WVLT) - On Friday, Gatlinburg city officials released a report detailing the downtown fire on Oct. 9 that killed one person and injured another.. Well I can say that if TEMA announced right now and emergency message to my cell phone in the east TN mountains I would never get a thing. This fire was supposedly set On November 23rd, we were hiking there on November 25th, they had the trail blocked off closer to the top of the Chimneys 2, however we made pictures of the fire and it and the picture shows the smoke going straight up in the air, no one was there and it didnt look like they had done anything to contain it. Copyright 2022 WVLT. The one thing I noticed over the fall was that the National Forest Service held themselves accountable, called in Incident Management Teams from all over the country with big wildfire experience and those teams got it done. In this instance, it is not only important to ask the questions its mandatory to question the answers if we are to achieve true critical thinking. The report stated the demolition was requested due to the health and safety of the citizens and visitors in the event of a full structure collapse.. The fire ballooned to more than 17,000 acres when winds stronger than 80 miles per hour carried the fire down the mountain and through Gatlinburg and parts of Pigeon Forge Nov. 28. Like I said this is like so many tragic events, a chain reaction of events that all contributed to a disastrous outcome, because of actions and inactions that were not questioned or corrected at many steps of the way.
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